Tuesday, 27 May 2014

Unbeaten: Chaos Warriors vs Wood Elves

It's All-Skype Fight Night!


After a bit of hashing out how we'd do this, General Stylus and I came to the conclusion the easiest solution was to have the physical battle at one end of the line and the other general acting as Rulebooks Monitor on the other. The general with the table would do all the movement, allowing a bit of leeway for their opponent not being able to measure as precisely as they usually would. And the other guy would check all the rules as needed. Dice throwing taken on honour, with the option of holding a camera up to particularly lucky strikes. 

I chose to set the table up, partly because I'd actually been reduced to painting scenery lately (I hate it, it's very resource heavy, dull and messy) and at least had some to show off for a change. 

What I didn't have was 
  • A table
  • Any scatter or artillery dice
  • Templates

Easily fixed! I wasn't raised by Blue Peter for nothing. Twenty minutes of frantic PVAing, cereal box mutilation and dice defacing yielded this. 

Warhammer Island of Blood, eat your heart out
We also decided on a joint battle report! I shall be writing in standard type, Stylus is in bold type this time. 

Hell yes. Bold and beautiful.


It was with a sinking heart I started working out how to beat Wood Elves with my Warriors of Chaos army. Superlight MSU archers? Hard-hitting fast cavalry? Why the hell didn't I buy more warhounds and horsemen?

Ah well. After three drafts, including one where I had four screening units of unarmed marauders to act as ablative armour and one with a pair of low-level disc riding sorcerors, I decided on something that would at least rest heavy on my opponent's brow. 

The bulk of my painted forces are heavy infantry. Slow but deadly, and vulnerable to enemy archers. But what if I had a magic phase that could help even the odds a little?

The Bull's Eyes

Bilious Bull, Chaos Sorceror Lord of Nurgle – Lore of Nurgle, lvl 3, Chaos Familiar, Poisonous Slime - 285
Gangrenous George, Exalted Hero BsB - Banner of Swiftness, Ruby Ring of Ruin - 175
1 Chariot - 110
15 Nurgle Marauders - G.weapon, light armour, full command - 210
10 Chaos Warriors - shields, full command,  – 180
Mutalith Vortex Beast – 240


Two bound spells (the ever popular Ruby Ring and the Mutalith's Aura of Mutation) plus four of Nurgle's spells - surely something any low-toughness army would blench at. And I could probably boss the magic phase as well. Heh heh heh.

The Twang! Gang

Glade Captain - Elven Steed, Shield, Asrai Spear. Hail of Doom Arrow.
Spellsinger - Lv 2 Shadows, Elven Steed. Dispel Scroll. Seed of Rebirth.
10 x Glade Guard - Musician, Hagbane Tips
10 x Glade Guard - Musician, Starfire Arrows
5 x Wild Riders - Shields, Full Command
5 x Wild Riders - Shields, Full Command
10 x Waywatchers
1 x Great Eagle


The Great Bear is the mounted general (plus one), the unicorn is an elven steed and the Rohirrim are Wild Riders.
Even my proxies have proxies.

Choosing this new army proved to be a fairly simple process. I couldn't begin to guess what elements of his 5000pt Chaos army Kraken would pick, so I just set to improve the army that got humiliatingly thumped last time

  • I removed the dead wood (heh heh) of Dryads and Treekin
  • I took Gen. East's endorsement of Wild Riders and took a unit of 5 with full command.
  • And then I took another unit. Because East really seemed to like them.
  • I removed the Hagbane Tips from the Waywatchers. Because apparently that's illegal.
  • I gave Starfire Arrows to one unit of Glade Guard, since whatever Kraken took, it would likely be tough, and evil.
    (as an aside, what do we think of arrows that specifically target half the opposing armies? In a one-off battle, it feels like tailoring; and in a tournament, it feels like a waste. Would it be so bad to have MoonStarFire Arrows that were flaming and +1 to Wound against everything?)
  • No room for a Waystalker, sadly (even though he was rubbish last time)
  • I downgraded my spellcaster from a Lv4 to a Lv2, after Kraken's advice that it was risky at this level (although I notice that didn't stop him from tooling-up a Sorcerer Lord ... perfidious Chaos...)
  • I put both my characters on steeds, figuring they were safer there than among the paper-thin Glade Guard.
  • And, in a show of optimism over experience, I kept the Hail of Doom on the General.

In the 2015 Movie Remake Version, the Wood Elves are played by the following proxies:
Glade Guard - Dark Elf Crossbowmen
Waywatchers - Goblin Archers
Wild Riders - Various
Glade Captain - Witch Hunter with Whip
Spellsinger - An Actual Goddamn Spellsinger!
Great Eagle - Warhawk

I had to say, when I saw Kraken's list, it had me worried (we exchanged lists before the battle, honour-bound not to look at them until both were finished). Unit for unit, I reckoned I could take them - except Chaos armies are so much more than their paper strength (they keep popping up with extra spells, mutations and spawn to ruin your day).

The Ruby Ring is, I think, a good choice against Wood Elves (clearly Kraken was paying attention when I bemoaning it last week). With the potential to knock off half a unit of Glade Guard, it's always going to draw dispel dice. And I was going to need all my dispel dice to deal with four Nurgle spells (another good lore against Wood Elves, as it hits their puny toughness), plus whatever that Mutalith coughs up.

My plan was to use the Wild Rider and Eagle to give the runaround, while my archers took out the faster moving elements (the Mutalith was going to be my first priority, as my Starfire Arrows would be perfect for wounding and negating regeneration), allowing me to surround and pick off the foot units. The danger for me was going to be the magic phase - I just had to weather the storm without taking much damage and I would be in with a chance.

I did consider an all-out attempt to assassinate the Chaos Sorcerer, but I knew he would be placed among the Chaos Warriors and, even with every unit shooting at them, I wasn't confident of knocking off every warrior to get to the Sorcerer. If I squandered my best round of shooting (the first turn is usually the best) and had nothing to show for it but a half-dozen dead Chaos Warriors, I'd be facing an uphill struggle.


Representing the frozen marshes deep in Kislev's forgotten Taiga today would be my kitchen floor: - 

A boggy valley filled with marshes (the streaky grey paper), two forests (white paper circles, both Venom Thickets as it worked out), a ruined tower and the remains of its stockade fence. The tall sections were impassable, we decided, and blocked line of sight; the shorter ones were just fences. A hill was placed in the Northwest and one in the Southeast with an Arcane Ruin on it, but neither of these saw any action and so won't get mentioned again.

As I'd set up the table, Stylus picked an edge. I deployed first, and stuck very much to the time honoured tradition of going as far in as I could and getting ready to leg it through a big empty space that was soon to be filled with missile fire. The BSB went with the Warrior unit, the general hid in the slightly larger pack of cannon fodder provided by the Marauders.

As Kraken had so obligingly set up a killing ground in the centre of the field, I deployed with the aim of shooting into it. The Wild Riders went down first - I wasn't particularly bothered where, as I'd just vanguard them to a better position. The Starfire archers went opposite the Mutalith and the Hagbane archers against the Chariot. And the Eagle went behind the tower. I don't know why I insist on hiding Eagles behind buildings, but I do (card-carrying member of the RSPB).

And then I saw the Chaos Sorcerer deployed with the Marauders. Now, Chaos Warriors scared me, but I reckon I could wipe out a unit of Marauders in one turn. Throwing out my previous concerns about assassination - I decided to go for it. The Waywatchers deployed behind the Marauders, ready to shoot.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

For spells, I rolled 2,3,4 and 5 on the Lore of Nurgle. So I missed out on Plague Wind, sadly, but the rest would do nicely. Not much point in the poison weapons spell, I decided, not with Starfire arrows knocking about, so I swapped that out for the Template Burp spell. But Rancid Visitations, Curse of the Leper and Fleshy Abundance gave me a good flexible line up of extra saves and toughness or crippling attack spells.

For spells, I rolled a double 5, which gave me Pit of Shades and a free pick. My pick was either going to be The Withering or Ockham's Mindrazor. And after having such meagre effects with The Withering in the last battle, I naturally went ahead and picked... The Withering.

Yeah, I'll wither 'em. I'll wither 'em up real good...

Then I got to go first. 

So I was going second. But I did get to start proceedings with the Arrow of Kurnos into his general. He was T4, so my chances of doing any damage was...

... it got him! It bloody got him! One wound off - in your [tentacled] face!

WoC Turn 1

"Everyone head for the elves and start killing them," yelled my general, and so that's what we did. The wood elf line seemed horribly distant, and had already lapped round my flanks. And some simpering ponce had already shot my general for a third of his wounds. At least he'd forgotten his vanguard moves, we later realised.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

Nothing fancy, and as expected, a fairly short first turn from me. The magic phase was a fizzle. Stylus dispelled the Ruby Ring and Rancid Visitations (both targeting his General and Wild Riders), the Mutalith wasn't in range of anything and I failed to cast Curse of the Leper on the Marauders.

Wood Elf Turn 1

Yes, I'd forgotten to vanguard. Let's pretend that was part of my plan.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

No charges from me, just a bit of positioning. The Spellsinger's Wild Riders scooted around the flank, making sure they were in casting range of the whole Chaos army. The Waywatchers and Glade Guard moved for line of sight; the Eagle moved to set itself up to get charged; and the General's Wild Riders tried to get on the Marauder's flank - they were at risk of being charged, but I had plans for that...

Nothing subtle about the magic phase: I just threw every dice at Withering the Marauder unit. The spell went off, although they only dropped one point of toughness.

'Only one' point of toughness. It sounds so little, and yet feels so bad.

Not too much subtle about the shooting phase either: with a whoosh! and twang!, the Waywatchers unloaded 20 fast shots, killing 6 Marauders. The Glade Captain followed up with Hail of Doom (I rolled an average 10 shots, which I'll take), killing another 7 Marauders. Before the already-wounded Chaos Sorcerer had time to look nervous, six more poisoned shots from the Glade Guard struck, wiping out the remains of the unit and killing the general.

The Starfire archers shot at the Chaos Warriors, only killing one of them. But having knocked off 500pts in a single round of shooting, I wasn't too disappointed.

I'm so glad to hear that.

WoC Turn 2

This was already shaping up well, I could see. The Chariot was in theoretical range of some w'elven revenge, so I declared an optimistic charge on the glade guard. I didn't make it and lost a wound to the poisonous stand and fire reaction. Behind the chariot, the Vortex Beast shambled into place to cover my flank, sort of.

The Warrior unit charged the eagle, which did what all noble eagles in fantasy literature do and buggered off. Determined perhaps to win 'Best Feigned Flight' in the Oscars this year, it really committed to its pretence of panic and never came back.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

In the magic phase, I killed an entire wood elf with the Ruby Ring of Ruin all by myself! And then the spellsinger's dispel scroll kept the Mutalith's aura at bay.

Wood Elf Turn 2

Well, the Eagle didn't rally (didn't it see me shoot up the Marauders like it was East L.A.?), the archers stayed put and the Spellsinger's Wild Riders ran around to threaten the back of the Chaos Warriors.

The Glade Captain's Wild Riders were a bit bolder, and declared a charge against the Chariot's flank. The only way to sneak past the Mutalith was to clip the marshlands with a couple of riders, but I was confident I'd pass those Dangerous Terrain tests. My confidence was well-founded, and I roll a pair of 2s for the test.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

... what's that? Cavalry fail Marshland terrain tests on a 1 or 2? Well, they're both dead then, sunk into the bog. Those poor mudders...

Knowing when I'm onto a good thing, I repeated my tactic of lobbing six dice at The Withering (Mutalith Vortex Beast this time). The spell went off, the beastie was softened up nicely for some arrows.

And the arrows followed. I don't think any of the Starfire arrows got him (either out of range or sight), but the Waywatchers and the Hagbane archers were enough to wipe its five wounds and take it off the board.

Only three points of toughness this time. I suspect the Starfire couldn't get it because it was already dead.

Even with two elves down, the Wild Riders made short work of the Chariot, smashing it up before it even had a chance to fight back. I then hit a snag: the Wild Riders were frenzied, which meant they were forced to overrun, and the only place they could do it was into the flank of the Chaos Warriors.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

And so my cavalry conducted a not-entirely voluntary charge across the battlefield into the final enemy unit. Even with a flank charge, the Chaos Warriors were safer than they would have been exposed in the open. So they had it pretty good really. 

WoC Turn 3

It's nice being able to relax in combat, knowing all the hard decisions have been made for you. My tactical input this turn was yelling "I Challenge!" on behalf of the BSB, because why on earth would he not even if he didn't have to?

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

Somebody needs to teach all these pushy elves some manners, always insisting on going first in everything. Patiently, my Exalted Hero let the elven general ram a spear into him for a bit, then clobbered him off his horse hard enough to cut both mount and rider in half. As a reward from the gods, he got an extra point of toughness. No bad thing, there didn't seem to be much of it about at the moment.

The rest of the combat was cheerfully bloody - I lost a couple of men to the Wild Riders' appalling charge, but so did they. With overkill from the challenge, my various banners and his flank charge, it somehow worked out as a draw. We were all set to reform and continue, with Stylus grimly realising he'd have to charge in with the Spellsinger's unit to finish me off, until he realised his musician was dead and it wasn't a draw after all. So the Wild Riders fled instead, which was what he wanted them to do in the first place.

I reformed towards the Spellsinger, determined not to give any of the archers the satisfaction of acknowledgement. It would only encourage them.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

Wood Elf Turn 3

So my General was dead. I don't think I was paying close enough attention to that combat (I either thought it was a forlorn hope, or my mind was already on the victory podium ... take your pick). I forgot that I had a champion who could have accepted the challenge, I forgot my musician was killed in the final resolution, and I forgot the Riders were on stags (Steeds of Kurnos, whatever), not horses, and so were at higher strength.

Either way, they had fled, which was a fair result, especially as the Chaos Warriors got to move to the top of my archers' 'to-do' list.

A Warhammer Fantasy Battle Report between Warriors of Chaos and Wood Elves.

The Great Eagle again failed to rally, probably terrified of the sight of all that blood (mostly Chaos blood, admittedly) and fled off the table for sunnier uplands. The surviving Wild Riders rallied, then rocked back in their saddles to watch the show.

The archers moved into position, while other Wild Riders ran behind the impenetrable wall, hidden from the Chaos Warriors, because when the battle is this close, why take chances?

I rolled well for the magic phase, and my Spellsinger lined up Pit of Shades...

... nah, he didn't. The Withering. All my dice. Chaos Warriors. -3T. Job done.

The Waywatcher's fast shots took out the whole unit of Toughness 1 Chaos Warriors, leaving only the Battle Standard, wounded and alone, staring defiantly as the Starfire arrows fill the sky.

... damn, it's like the finale of 300.

Raindrops keep falling on my head

Final Score: 1400: 354


Well, that went almost as well as I expected.

The death of his general was a great balm to my wounds. We were unbeaten in close combat throughout the battle, so that's something. Hard to know how I could have done any better, really.

A decent first round of magic might have led to a second one and fewer elves peppering me with death. Stylus seemed convinced my Sorceror should have been hiding in the tougher Warrior unit, but I suspect that they wouldn't really have fared any better under that weight of fire. Maybe two warrior units instead of bothering with Marauders at all? And certainly the Mark of Nurgle and Greatswords was over-egging an already dubious pudding, in hindsight. Mind you, if any Treekin had turned up, they'd have been worth it.

Wrong size of battle to try the Vortex Beast in, I think. Too expensive for too random an ability, not that I got to actually see it in action. Another unit of troops, or a warshrine and a second chariot would have been much better options. Or some fast cavalry. That was already at the top of my shopping list. It's gone even higher since, I'm trying to sneak it into this week's groceries without my wife noticing.

Still, good thing I made all those templates and scatter dice, eh?

Well, that went a little better than I expected.

Aside from a cowardly Eagle and over-zealous Wild Riders, that battle was pretty damn perfect (I'll take the blame for not anticipating where the Wild Riders could have ended up - staying out of combat is still a new thing to get my head around).

Reviewing the dice rolls, I didn't even have spectacularly good luck (Hail of Doom was, for example, about par), but my dice results were better because I wasn't making it harder for myself (better positioning of the archers, and not fidgeting with them). I was fortunate, I guess, not to fluff my shots against the Marauders - once Kraken's general was dead, the battle was mine for the taking.

The best luck I had in the game was rolling for spells and being able to pick The Withering. I'll disregard everything I said about it: this spell is awesome for Wood Elves. I'd say it's worth going with a Lv4 Shadow, just to increase your chances of picking this spell. Once a unit has been withered, they are such easy prey for Wood Elf volleys

For all their recklessness, I liked the Wild Riders (adding some much-needed mobility to my army). I now feel honour-bound to fish my models out of their Dettol bath and paint them up properly.


Skype worked really well for this! A really enjoyable night, despite my drubbing. And the brevity of the battle actually gave us time for a good long catch up, postmortem and general bearding discussion to boot. I'd definitely do this again, and therefore throw down the gauntlet for anyone else who'd care to pick it up. Give me your squires, your spawn, your skaven masses yearning to die free, etc.

I second this - SkypeBoot worked brilliantly, and I'm well up for making this a regular feature.

Some observations about remote battling:

  • The 'home' player has to do more work in terms of preparation and moving things around (so kudos to Kraken for being an excellent host and a gracious loser).
  • Thanks! That's years of practice for you. 
  • It really speeds up the game to have the 'away' player on the rules and army lists. Since I was staring at a computer screen the whole time, I had the both army lists and rules in front on me on different tabs - being able to answer any rules or stats queries immediately.
  • I didn't find much difficulty with not being present on the field - I was sketching a few notes as we went along, and relying on Kraken for placement (the 'measure-everything' 8th Ed really makes this possible - you can just state how far away you'd like something to be)
  • We soon discovered that, on a Skype screen, left was right, and right was left. This caused a moment of confusion (and the rather odd request "hold up what you perceive to be your left hand") until I made the adjustment before issuing instructions.


  1. Great report, sounds like it worked really well over Skype.
    I would be up for giving this a go for sure!

    Glade you see the synergy of the withering and then new woodies, a very powerful combination. Putting your caster in with the wild riders could present problems with frenzy etc :) Also no way of keeping her in the second rank without more chars.

    The sisters work well for a fast cav bunker, and a little more variety with spells is good. The wild riders in my opinion are just there to smash things in the face as often as they can. Flank charges, even on Gore beast chariots will see them have great success.

    A decent flank charge on the warrior block with a full strength unit of wild riders will leave relatively few warriors left standing, in units of 5 opt not to take a champ so you can decline those challenges! I can safely say that your WoC opponent will at this point state, "135 points for that unit?" "what a joke". As he takes off 250 points of warriors :)

    1. I dunno about the chariots, but I'd certainly agree they'd put a good dint in Warriors. Problem being if anyone's left standing, you're going to lose out fast.

      The chariot only just went down and no more. T5, high WS and I opponents means you don't get all your rerolls from them - mine died as it was already wounded. But even four high strength return hits could lose you a lot of effectiveness fast, I reckon. Even in a low points game, a unit of 5 could vanish in a flash.

      And challenge accepted! Bring on the D'elves.

    2. you will get your re rolls on initiative values, plus flank charge means no attacks from mounts so no gore beast attacks, tough 6 so 5`s to wound, 15 re roll to hit attacks will give you around 2/3 wounds plus charge plus flank and poss a banner, your handlers attacks back = 2 wounds max, so you will win by a considerable margin. No more gore beast chariot.

      The price for the wild riders if used right is very little, and to me they are cheaper enough not to be over cautious with them. I will charge them into must things.

      A unit of 6 for me in the last 3 games have taken of 2 gore beast chariots a chimera and 3 mournfang, yes in the first round :)

      believe me if they take out 10 warriors in the first round, warriors reform to face I could not really care less if they die in the second round of combat, they have done more than there points would lead you to expect :)

      Dark elves it is :)

    3. Ah, I see what you mean about re-rolls to hit: we were playing on the assumption that you needed ASF and a higher initiative to re-roll - turns out you can be equal or higher (I've been robbed!)

      A bunker unit of Sisters did make my first draft - I think I dropped them in disgust after reading the rules for Shield of Thorns. Turns out the Wild Riders did the same job, since they never saw combat, but I'd take Sisters in a bigger game to babysit a Spellweaver.

      Have you had any luck with the Treeman?

    4. I have run durthu once in a 3k game, and yes he rocked :)

      The new stat line on the standard treemen is not to bad, the downside is they are competing against waywatchers and eagles which both have a massive role in the army I think.

      As for the sisters, forget shield of thorns but the curse is a brilliant spell, plus poisoned javelins on fast cav and a 4 up ward..........yes please :)

    5. Plus on another note, as you mentioned previously your stag mounts on the wild riders will also get 2 attacks each (frenzy) at str 4, so with 10 attacks you would hope to pop another wound onto the chariot :)

      WoC is a really nice match up for the Woodies, along with Brts and Empire. I think they will struggle against deamons and dark/high elves thou.

      I really cannot bring myself to include the treemen, just cannon magnets really, also I cannot bring myself to build a combat orientated army, the just will not do well.

      Also you said you dropped your lvl 4 to 2 why was that?
      With the points drop on the weaver a lvl 4 is the first thing I would pick up. :)

    6. @Kraken, let me know what points value you want to play so I can start compiling the filthy Dark Elves :)

    7. I hadn't realised the gorebeast wouldn't fight! Perhaps I'll read the chariot rules one day. Handlers have two attacks each, at least, so four kills on a very good day. I also hadn't realised the mounts had frenzy - is that intended? The mounts don't have a separate stat line, so I guess they do. Yikes.

      What dates might suit? Do you want to host or shall I? Shall we say 1500 points? How many Doomfire Warlocks does that buy you?

    8. I was about to make the same comment: mounts don't have frenzy, but I've checked the rules and East is right: the Wild Riders have specific rules (ASF, Devastating Charge) and then the whole model has rules (Fear, Forest Stalker, Frenzy etc) - so the stags do get an extra attack.

      At least that makes sense why Steeds of Kurnos/Steeds of Isha are different - Steeds of Kurnos are, as you'd expect, more attack-orientated. So a 130pt Wild Rider unit can put out 25 S5/4 attacks (with 15 re-rolls) - with their speed and manoeuvrability, that's some damn good cavalry right there.

    9. "Also you said you dropped your lvl 4 to 2 why was that?"

      Partly because Kraken sowed the seeds of doubt in my mind from my last battle report about taking a Lv4 at this scale (dirty Tzeentchian trick...)

      But I was also concerned about the points sink: a Lv4 with a few essentials (like dispel scroll), plus a basic Sisters of Thorn bunker is going to run to something like 400pts, which is a 1/3 of my army. With their speed and ward save, I should be able to keep them alive, but they'd have to really be effective to justify the expenditure.

      That said, if I'm taking Shadows, I may always go Lv4 just to be sure of getting the good spells - I'd hate to start a battle with just Steed of Shadows in my shot locker.

      Any thoughts on other magic? Are the High/Dark lores any better than the standard ones?

    10. They're both very shooty, particularly Dark, with a number of high cost and deadly spells. Doombolt is also a particularly good signature missile, I'd take Dark magic if I was able to for the bazooka effects it offers.

  2. And on the subject of SkypeBoot - if other Woffers are agreeable to it (and you all have a year to try it out), I'd propose we use this for future WoffBoots if Kraken (or anyone else trapped overseas by the passport office) is unable to attend.

    We could set up a computer screen to use as the 'third table' (can it work on the cinema screen? Because a 'life-scale' SkypeBoot sounds awesome) - so Virtual Kraken can join in all the fun (maybe not the hot tub, unless we unplugged it first).

  3. LOL that sounds like a great plan,

    I have yet to try out high or dark magic.
    I really cannot see it being more effective than shadow, but saying that high as some appeal for me as the defensive counters are pretty awesome.

    3 more games in today with the Woodies against the WoC.
    3 more wins to the tally :) again all I can say is "wild riders."
    They are a unreal unit, today's victims included a Hell Cannon, gore beast and normal chariot`s and to top it off from a flank charge they put to flight a warrior`s unit packed full of chars totaling nearly a 1000 points!

    All this for a measly 176 points :)

    The waywatchers were as usual awesome, loving the new warhawk riders.
    T4 And 3 wounds was a great buff for them, making them some of the best re directors in the game now, and all for just 135 points :)

    Sisters were just a nice fast cav bunker with the lichbone standard making a impressive 3+ ward versus magic attacks. Glade riders we great really like these guy`s with hagbane tips.

    Then 3 units of glade guard, 2 with hagbane tips and one with starfire arrows.

    Starfire arrows are a great choice, I know Stylus you mentioned that you was a little put off by the +1 one to wound on only 50% of the armies, how I look at it is like this, forget the +1 to wound that's a bonus, although lets be honest most of the scary armies are evil :) But essentially you are paying 10 points extra than hagbane on a unit of 10, and that means you are getting flaming attacks for 10 points!

    Flaming is massive in the meta atm, due to the amount of regen around. So to get the same effect from a banner would be a extra 10 points on top of the arrows (standard and flaming banner). So I for sure will have at least one unit of them in the list, aswell as having a second unit with the banner, I may even look to put that on to one of the wild rider units, to negate regen in different phases.

    Anyway next game is Thursday against VC or High Elves, so will keep you updated on how those go!

    1. My next question was going to be about Warhawks: are they a better redirector than the humble (and expendable) Great Eagle, or just more durable?

      I'd see them as hunters of war machines, fast cavalry or missile troops - the stuff that could challenge Wood Elves for control of the table. Although I suppose they could be used as kamikaze assassins - using their killing blow on front-rank characters.

      I take your point about the Starfire Arrows, it's not a bad price for flaming attacks, and they'll make great monster hunters. It's more about the rules untidiness (and seems to be designed for tournament play, since a player could just switch between individual battles) - as well as the fact that Tomb Kings and Ogres would be immune to the 1+ to Wound from either type of arrow!

    2. The warhawks are just versatile now, got more of a chance to survive the first round of combat so can semi tarpit the right units.

      They are indeed also great war machine hunters. but that's the versatility they bring over eagles. Can shot if there's nothing else to do, can hunt down fast units or war machines effectively or have a good chance of a sustained redirect.

      Don`t get me wrong the eagles are good because you can take them as single models, but you can now also join them up as units like the high elves, so 3 eagles would cost you 15 points more than 3 warhawk riders which do more..............go figure.........nice job GW :)

      Sometimes its just nice to have multiple single redirecting options, which is why you will see the eagles on the table more times then not.

  4. The question is: how do these new supercharged Wild Riders compare with the dreaded Doomfire Warlocks?

    They must be superior in combat, but without the Doombolt or the high ward save. On the other hand, they occupy a Special slot, not a Rare one...

  5. Indeed, chalk and cheese :)

    The sisters are are comparable to the doomfire warlocks, but lack the punch of spells, but let me tell you the curse and acorn of the ages creating multiple venom thickets is nothing to sneer at :) can nearly be as devastating as dweller :)

    Just to have a magic orientated fast cav bunker for your magic users and ineffective glade capt is really nice. The curse will just slow things down whilst you dance around on your merry way, leaving more time for shooting :)

    1. Although it does make me think that somebody ought to fight Wood vs Dark elves so we could find out the answer properly...

    2. I would step up, but I lose to Gen East so consistently, it would hardly be a controlled experiment. ;-)

    3. Yeah I need to fight that battle, although I believe the Dark elves will hold the edge if I am honest :)

    4. I believe our last encounter was a uphill struggle for me :) being kicked in the ass by Gork`s foot is not a nice experience :)

  6. So then, General East - if I host as I did last time (partly because I have a sparkly kitchen floor and partly because I clearly can't handle a rules manual), when might we get this game on? Some evening in the coming fortnight?

  7. Yes sure, the only nights that I really struggle throughout the week is Thursday, which is my warhammer club night, Monday I am available from around 7.30pm. The rest should be fine, work allowing.

    Let me know when suits you will work to that.

  8. Well, how's Wednesday then? I can be ready to start at 1930 sharp. We can swap army lists the day before, or later if that suits, so I can pick out appropriate proxies.

  9. Yeah sounds good, what point values are we playing?
    And what do I need from my end?

  10. Let's say 1600. On your end, if you have your dice and all the rules (core rulebook and the two army lists) to hand in whatever format suits you best, and you'll be master of stats and facts. I'll have the models and the kitchen floor, and may the most depraved master of evil win!

  11. lol :) I am will send you my list tonight

  12. Hello, great report, I would like to issue a challenge on the battlefield via Skype! Goid interesting read unlike the monotone reports that fill the web! Chaos can't do much against we unless it's skullcrushers and knights baaed. Good report!

    1. Hello! And thanks for your challenge. What sort of match are you interested in?